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Is there a possibility of multi-tracking and outputting within the Watchout


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#1 Marc Meloche

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Posted 12 May 2011 - 08:57 PM

Here is what I would like to do:

Attach via firewire a Motu traveller mk32
Have 4 stereo audio tracks and 3 mono audio tracks and assign them to individual outputs as follows:

Outputs 1 & 2 Hd Vox
Outputs 3 & 4 Hd Percs
Outputs 5 & 6 Hd Keys
Outputs 7 & 8 Hd Guitars
Output 9 Count
Output 10 Click
Output 11 Lead Vocal Safety

And all this with a 3 watchout display
One more question.
Is the Watchout able to send Midi Timecode.
I would potentially like to try syncing with an adat hd24 via MTC or SMTP (only if Mtc does not work)

Thank you in advance for your answer.

My best regards to you and Bonjour Richard

;-)

Marc

#2 jfk

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 07:12 PM

Here is what I would like to do
1 Attach via firewire a Motu traveller mk3
2 Have 4 stereo audio tracks and 3 mono audio tracks and assign them to individual outputs

as follows:
Outputs 1 & 2 Hd Vox
Outputs 3 & 4 Hd Percs
Outputs 5 & 6 Hd Keys
Outputs 7 & 8 Hd Guitars
Output 9 Count
Output 10 Click
Output 11 Lead Vocal Safety

And all this with a 3 watchout display

Simple answer is yes it can be done.
Each watchout display is capable of eight channels of output.
Audio synch between displays is very good, but not phase accurate perfect.
With the way you have split up your audio,
that should not be an issue however.

As for the motu, you need to test that with your hardware setup.
We do have customers who use Firewire motu boxes,
but your results may vary as your hardware is not identical to those who report success.

One more question. Is the Watchout able to send Midi Timecode. I would potentially like to try syncing with an adat hd24 via MTC or SMTP (only if Mtc does not work)

There is no provision in WATCHOUT for output of either MTC or SMPTE.
(WATCHOUT does read and synch to all forms of SMPTE.)

Many users simply drop a wav file of SMPTE timecode on the timeline
to send SMPTE from WATCHOUT using the standard audio outputs.
WATCHOUT will keep the .wav file in synch with the content, even
during editing while jumping around.


#3 Claude.Rivet

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Posted 22 June 2011 - 11:51 PM

Is it still required to work with a broadcast wave file or is there a way to use discrete file for each channel and assign it (wo5)?

#4 jfk

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 05:35 PM

Is it still required to work with a broadcast wave file or is there a way to use discrete file for each channel and assign it (wo5)?


Yes, a multi-channel wav file is the best way to achieve multi-channel audio output.

No, there is no way to assign an audio file to a specific output channel in WATCHOUT,
that is defined within the multi-channel wav file itself.

The Microsoft WAVE_FORMAT_EXTENSIBLE file format is capable of assigning a mono wav file to a specific output channel
by manipulating the channel mask data, but,
I have not seen any utility or sound program that provides this function. i.e.
You would have to hack the wav file header data to achieve that. (in other words, it is not a very practical solution).

#5 Jonas Dannert

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Posted 16 December 2011 - 06:39 PM

On a side-note:

MOTU does NOT support DirectSound (part of the DirectX framework WATCHOUT uses),
on more than stereo 2 channels in their drivers for Windows 7, Vista or XP.

So for more than 2 channels in WATCHOUT, one have to choose other solutions.

Tested by us, and found working, is:
Echo Audiofire 12 (up to 12 analog channels in XP, up to 8 in Windows 7), Firewire interface
Echo Audiofire 8 (up to 8 analog channels in XP and Windows 7), same hardware as above
ESI 1010e, (up to 8 analog channels in XP and Windows 7). PCIe interface

#6 Mike Fahl

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 08:27 PM

The Microsoft WAVE_FORMAT_EXTENSIBLE file format is capable of assigning a mono wav file to a specific output channel
by manipulating the channel mask data, but, I have not seen any utility or sound program that provides this function.


Actually, we do have a utility to do just that, which I put together a few weeks back. I believe JME may have written some instructions, but it should be fairly straightforward to use. Let me know if you need it, and I'll pass it on.

#7 jfk

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 09:21 PM

Actually, we do have a utility to do just that, which I put together a few weeks back. I believe JME may have written some instructions, but it should be fairly straightforward to use. Let me know if you need it, and I'll pass it on.


That is great!

How versatile is the tool?
i.e. can it also designate a channel pair (1-2, 3-4, 5-6, 7-8) for a stereo .wav file?
That is the most common request I see, one stereo pair for each video output in a four output single computer.

#8 Mike Fahl

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Posted 23 December 2011 - 08:33 PM

Yes, it can assign channels also for stereo (and even mono) files. I'll try to attach the application to this post. Hopefully that will work. You'll also need Adobe AIR in order to install it. Since it's an AIR app, it works fine on both Mac and Win. Get AIR here:

http://get.adobe.com/air/

Give it a try, and let me know if it fits the bill. I don't have any documentation available yet, but it should be fairly self explanatory.

Mike

Attached Files



#9 Bryan Burris

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Posted 04 April 2012 - 11:01 PM

I like this tool, but is it possible to make a stereo .wav file into a mono track? Essentially a way to combine the channels?

#10 Mike Fahl

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 11:57 AM

This tool doesn't mix audio channels. It merely re-maps channels to another channel numbers. If you want to mix down a stereo to a mono, something like the free Audacity (or any other decent sound editor) should fit the bill.

Mike

#11 Brian

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Posted 13 April 2012 - 04:05 AM

The free program Audacity will mono a stereo file for you. It can also write the MS Ext .wav format 8 channel "surround" file.

I use this to create the files and one of the Echo cards listed above to play back 8 channels from each WatchOUT server I have. No problems so far!

#12 JackSchaberg

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 03:41 PM

Hi.

 

We're finishing up a Watchout project. I've downloaded the ChannelShifter utility to my computer and have gotten a little familiar with it. 

 

Our video is showing in a theater with the following speaker configuration: front left, front center, front right, side left, side right, rear left, rear right. However, it's not going be to a true surround sound mix. For instance, the narration and score will always come from the front speakers. The side and rear speakers are used for occasional sound effects throughout. Right now, we have the narration on one track, some VO on another track, music on a track, and sound effect on several tracks. I understand that using the Channelshift utility, we can assign certain .wav files to a certain speaker, or speakers.

 

A few questions:

 

1. In experimenting with ChannelShifter, I see 18 options for assigning audio. What do I need to do to so that it will show only the seven available? Or won't I be able to do that until the .wav files are inside Watchout? 

 

2. If that's the case, then when I drag the .wav file into ChannelShifter, will it know that there are only seven options? 

 

3. Can we assign a single .wav file to multiple speakers? 

 

4. What does "Standard Assignments" refer to?

 

5. Most of our .wav files are mono, others are stereo. How does this affect how the channels can be assigned?

 

I'm sure I'll have more questions along the way, but for now, any assistance is much appreciated.

 

Thanks!

 

jack



#13 Mike Fahl

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 07:13 PM

1. In experimenting with ChannelShifter, I see 18 options for assigning audio. What do I need to do to so that it will show only the seven available? Or won't I be able to do that until the .wav files are inside Watchout? 

 

The options you see are the various possible channel names supported by the WAV file format.


2. If that's the case, then when I drag the .wav file into ChannelShifter, will it know that there are only seven options? 

 

No. Those 18 possible assignments will always be there. They're part of the WAV standard. However, when you drag a WAV file into the tool, it will only list the number of channels available in the file. Each of those channels can then be asigned to any of the 18 possible names.


3. Can we assign a single .wav file to multiple speakers? 

 

Yes and no. Each channel in the file can only be assigned to a single output name.


4. What does "Standard Assignments" refer to?

 

That button removes any name assignments youve applied, returning the file to its initial (default) sequential assignent, where each channel is assigned in order to each possible output name.

 

5. Most of our .wav files are mono, others are stereo. How does this affect how the channels can be assigned?

For a mono file, there's only a single channel you can assign to an output. For a stereo file, there are two. Either channel can be assigned to any output name (although those need to be assigned in ascentind order, due to limitations in the WAV file format).

 

Hope this helps.

 

Mike



#14 JackSchaberg

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 08:48 PM

Thanks, Mike. That's a big help and a great start.

 

Based on your answers, it looks as though we can start assigning channels prior to importing the .wav files into Watchout. One follow up:

 

Once the program is installed in the small theater and we're mixing the audio, if we decide that a certain sound would work better coming from a different speaker, is it simply a matter of dragging the .wav file into ChannelShifter and re-assigning it? Will those changes ripple through into Watchout?

 

Also, just so I'm clear, if we have a single channel (mono) SFX that we need to have coming from two speakers (at the same time) we'll need to duplicate the file (SFX_1 and SFX_2) and put it on two different tracks with the same start point, and then assign each file its own speaker.  Is that correct?

 

Thanks so much.

 

Jack



#15 jfk

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Posted 09 April 2013 - 02:53 PM

... Once the program is installed in the small theater and we're mixing the audio, if we decide that a certain sound would work better coming from a different speaker, is it simply a matter of dragging the .wav file into ChannelShifter and re-assigning it?

 

Correct

 

Will those changes ripple through into Watchout?

 

Simple answer is yes, but to be clear, after the changes are made and saved with channelshifter.air,

you must go online, or update if you are already online, to transfer the new files to the display computers.

WATCHOUT will detect the file has been changed when going online / update and automatically transfer the new version.

 

Also, just so I'm clear, if we have a single channel (mono) SFX that we need to have coming from two speakers (at the same time) we'll need to duplicate the file (SFX_1 and SFX_2) and put it on two different tracks with the same start point, and then assign each file its own speaker.  Is that correct?

 

Yes.



#16 JackSchaberg

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Posted 10 April 2013 - 03:51 PM

Thanks much. Extremely helpful.

 

Jack



#17 JackSchaberg

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Posted 10 April 2013 - 06:46 PM

If we have a .wav file with two channels, can we assign both channels to the same speaker in ChannelShifter?



#18 Jonas Dannert

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Posted 10 April 2013 - 06:51 PM

This question is answered earlier in this thread...

 

http://forum.dataton.com/topic/2-is-there-a-possibility-of-multi-tracking-and-outputting-within-the-watchout/#entry1332

 

"This tool doesn't mix audio channels. It merely re-maps channels to another channel numbers.

If you want to mix down a stereo to a mono, something like the free Audacity (or any other decent sound editor) should fit the bill."

 

/jonas



#19 andyp

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 08:20 AM

Hey guys, just wondering if it is possible to use an embedded 5.1 track in a quicktime file or does it need to be a separate .WAV ex file?



#20 Jonas Dannert

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 01:08 PM

A separate .WAVE-EX file and h264 or MPEG-2 video.

 

Described here: http://dataton.com/forum/topic/288-mpeg-settings/page__view__findpost__p__2369

See the pdf inside the post.

 

 

/jonas