uncompressed 5x HD wide video wall possible?

[Joe Remainz]

HI

 

Im new here and looking to see if Dataton is what I need for my project.

 

Im planning on running either one 9600 1080 60p file or 5x 1920 1080 60p synced files . 12 minutes long for a 25 meter wide projection.

 

The nature of the work means H264/MPEG2/H265 are not good enough for the graphics even at high data rates so Im looking for something close to uncompressed.

 

Can this be done with Dataton and the right hardware?

 

thanks a lot

 

Joe 

[jfk]

HI

 

Im new here and looking to see if Dataton is what I need for my project.

 

Im planning on running either one 9600 1080 60p file or 5x 1920 1080 60p synced files . 12 minutes long for a 25 meter wide projection.

 

The nature of the work means H264/MPEG2/H265 are not good enough for the graphics even at high data rates so Im looking for something close to uncompressed.

 

Can this be done with Dataton and the right hardware?

 

thanks a lot

 

Joe 

 

Yes, you can achieve multiple "uncompressed" (lossless) 1080p60 playback.

In either the uncompressed v.210 codec or as

TGA or TIFF RGB lossless 1920x1080 60p image sequences.

 

Yes it does require high end, high throughput systems

and the files take up a lot of space.

BTW When the number of outputs require multiple computers,

and with such high-end content, you do not want to use Live Edit,

it would roughly double your storage requirements!

 

On resolution of the video file,

I suspect you are going to need to go with five 1080p60,

I do not think a pixel dimension above 8k is going to work.

 

A movie with a 9600 pixel width may be an issue on the encoding side,

have you researched if you can encode uncompressed video that large?

 

Odd numbers of outputs are always fun when spread across multiple computer chassis.

As for hardware to handle the five outputs and meet your requirements

I would recommend

 

two WATCHMAX

storage speed upgrade

storage capacity upgrade

hardware synchronization upgrade

(or a qualified third party equivalent)

[zackboyd]

Just pointing out: It appears you are not accounting for a projection blend in the size of your content(assuming you have projectors with a 1920-wide raster). Before you create the content, just want to make sure you've considered it.

[Joe Remainz]

Thanks for the info.

 

May I ask how I work out what hardware is needed?

Is there a hardware guide somewhere that Ive overlooked?

Can this not be done on one PC with multiple graphics cards?

 

I should imagine that the Watchmax system will be overkill as Im not doing any live 3d etc . Plus two of these will surely cost more than my fee.

I have not even found the watchout licence price.

 

I have looked it the media type and TGA/TIFF sequence seems the best option as v210 does not support 9600 wide frames.

 

(Zack, I have done many seamless video installations before and have never needed to overlap beams as this always leads to blurry edges and light overlaps in the blacks. Properly positioned projectors always looks better.)

 

 

thanks a lot

 

Joe

[jfk]

I am really not liking the way the reply editor works in this forum ...

 

Thanks for the info.

 

May I ask how I work out what hardware is needed?

 

Besides the list for display computers I provided?

 

You would need a production computer too, but it is not as critical as the 

computers doing the real work.

 

So to be complete ...

 

two WATCHMAX each with

storage speed upgrade

hardware synchronization upgrade

one standalone WATCHOUT License

one PC for production station

 

you may not need the storage capacity upgrade if it is just 12 minutes of video

and you avoid live edit.

Is there a hardware guide somewhere that Ive overlooked?

 

Not really. The hardware suggestions in WATCHOUT Technical Notes - 2015

 are a bit dated and were written prior to "uncompressed" video support was added,

so they do not address that at all.

I am told Dataton is working on an update to those suggestions,

but your guess is as good as mine as to when that will occur.

 

Can this not be done on one PC with multiple graphics cards?

 

Well, since WATCHOUT supports the outputs on only one graphics card

even when SLI or Crossfire is used - no.

You still get the additional processing power of multiple GPUs (which you do not need)

but you will not get an increase in outputs.

 

That said, there are single graphcs cards that provide up to six outputs.

And that will work just fine for codecs like mpeg2, mpeg4, HAP.

 

But five 1920x1080 @ 60p uncompressed -

one PC will not keep up with that much demand.

 

I should imagine that the Watchmax system will be overkill as Im not doing any live 3d etc .

 

3D functions are a whole lot easier than uncompressed video.

A base WATCHMAX will handle 3D chores easily.

But even a base WATCHMAX is poorly suited for three 1080p60 uncompressed video decodes.

 

Plus two of these will surely cost more than my fee.

 

Well, five uncompressed video streams (or one stream of equivalent pixels)

is not going to be inexpensive no matter how you approach it.

Uncompressed video is by far and away the most significant resource hog,

 so it is going demand the most costly hardware support.

Expecting one project to pay off that hardware cost is a bit optimistic,

alternately look at rental for the project instead.

 

I have not even found the watchout licence price.

 

WATCHMAX includes the license in its price.

But if you want the standalone license price ... WATCHOUT License

 

I have looked it the media type and TGA/TIFF sequence seems the best option as v210 does not support 9600 wide frames.

 

I still think you are going to run into an 8K max from the GPU buffers,

no matter what you encode it in.

Furthermore, multiple 1080p decodes will better utilize the available cpu threads 

than one super sized decode.

 

Have tried one 3840x2160 60p  TIFF image sequence,

and could not get that to play smoothly.

On the same machine that could  play four 1920x1080 60p TIFF image sequences fine.

While on the surface that may seem to defy logic.

The spreading out of the decode workload with four files instead of one big one

would be a logical explanation.

 

(Zack, I have done many seamless video installations before and have never needed to overlap beams as this always leads to blurry edges and light overlaps in the blacks. 

 

One might suggest you are not doing it right if that is your typical result.

 

​Properly positioned projectors always looks better.)

 

Not sure what that means - with mullions between projectors?

butted with no mullions? (can't believe that is it)

[Joe Remainz]

Thanks jfk

 

I will take a look but your talking a budget that would make a national museum wince.

I will see if I can hire them in Barcelona Spain where the show is but Im guessing that these things are not so easy to find.

 

In terms of projection overlap have you never noticed that the blacks are never black and when they overlap they create overlap highlights. This is the case on all overlapping projections except the most high end laser projections.  

If you are showing in a lit public space then nobody will notice but not in a dark Gallery where it looks very amateur. Perfectly aligned projectors simply means there is no gap or seam , (and no keying either).

I have done it like this many times and looks perfect.