Datapath VisionSC-SDI4 Sync Problem at 1080i @25fps?

[Jocelino]

Hi all,

 

Using the new Datapath VisionSC-SDI4 with the signals that a TV broadcasters are giving us, we have some problems. I sent a ticket to Datapath with this information and I'm waiting for a reply.

 

Specification of the PC - including processor speed

PC Player for Dataton Watchout – i7-5930K; Motherboard X99; 16 GB RAM; SSD Samsung 128GB for SO; SSD Samsung 256GB in Raid0 ; FireproW7100 4Gb Graphics Card

 

Operating System

Windows 7 Pro 64 bits

 

Application Software

Dataton Watchout v6.1.5 but we check the same problem using the Vision Window from Datapath software (at full screen window mode)

 

Datapath Hardware / Software:

2 units of VisionSC-SDI4 with last VisionInstall_v7141 installation driver (after the installation, the firmware of the cards were updated by the program)

 

The exact nature of the problem:

 

We’ve installed in each WATCHOUT players 2 units of VisionSC-SDI4.

We are receiving 8 SDI signals in each player – One Capture board unit has 4x 1080i @25fps; the other capture board has 4x 576i  @25fps

 

In the Vision Window of Datapath (Datapath software - in full screen at 1920x1080p) we notice a problem in the top of the image of animated loops and conventional images with some speed. We tried all the 8 inputs ( 4 HD and 4 SD) with different source images, HD and SD and all the inputs have the same problem.

 

If the datapath window of the software is smaller that the full screen, we don't see the problem occur.

 

Using Dataton software we see the effect in a lower place in the image; the bottom part field it's first to appear, that the top field part.

If I trim the top of the signal (1, 5 or 10 pixels), the place of the division of the image will be near the top, always at the same position (indepndently if it's trimmed 1, 5 or 10 pixels).

Apply frame blending of the live video input doens't change this.

 

Please see the photos and videos of the link:

 

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ls1j7rjfz9dp1kw/AAC2MugN-g5ywg_vYSD3kYLBa?dl=0

 

We have the new 55VH7 LG Videowall displays connected to the output of the FireproW7000. At the beginning we had the output to the Videowall monitors at 1920x1080p @ 60Hz. After changing all the type of set up We changed the output of the PC graphic card to 1920x1080p @ 50Hz (to tried to see if with 50Hz that is the double of the 25Hz the system had a different result, we check and uncheck the "Aplly frame blending" in both refresh rate with the same result).

 

But the problem continues.

 

All the HD_SDI signals came from a broadcast system on the Broadcast Rack. We’ve connected a HD-SDI monitor to the same cables and we don’t have this problem. We've connected the same sigmal to a Blackmagic SDI>HDMI connected directly to the videowall monitor and it's OK.

 

At the Source desk they don’t have any configuration to change, because we receive the same signal from a HD-SDI distributors and the other connected equipment receive the signal perfectly.

 

It looks like a sync problem. They asked if we can put a REF signal in, but we can’t do that in the VisionSC-SDI4

 

Did you had this kind of problem in a capture card using Watchout? What was the way to solve?

 

Thanks

 

 

[Adela Kriland]

Hello. Just to check. In the power tweak of the mb you have power not restricted to the pci ?

 

//Adela

[zackboyd]

I agree it looks like a sync issue. Do you have a S400 card in the system? I'd try syncing the outputs to the source.

[TiagoFrutuoso]

Hi Adela,

I manage IT for Mr. Jocelino's company and i've configured the systems he mentions. Thing is, the MB does not allow to tweak power to the PCIe Cards. Only to adjust PCIe Speeds according to generation. We are still waiting for feedback by Datapath...

[Alex Ramos]

The CPU as 40 PCIe lanes but you don't mention the motherboard model.

 

Make sure that the motherboard can supply PCIe x8 to the Vision cards.

Try just one card installed and different PCIe slots.

 

Try to enable the DirectGMA on the Firepro software, dont know if the VisioSC is compatible, some Datapath cards are. 

 

And sure you must try a different source

[Jocelino]

Hi All,

 

Motherboard ASUSTEK  MB X99-DELUXE LGA2011-V3 8DDR4 ATX

 

We've sent the diagtool file to Datapath and they are trying to understand the error effect in the image.

 

If we install the driver as KERNEL mode, we have the 1080i@25Hz working fine in WO, but we have only 1 source at a time in each card because WO doens't work in Kernel mode, only in User mode.

 

We've reinstalled the drivers in User mode and if we use 1 card only the error image effect it's the same. In Vision Window Software at the begginig (before cahngig to Kernel and returning to User mode driver) we saw the error in all of the image in each of the 8 input sources, but now in Vision Window (Datapath software) we can't see the image error effect, but in WO the image error continues in all of the 8 input sources.

 

We've installed 1 of the cards in a older WO Player with v6.1.2 and it's the same to test and understand the problem. This system has 1 SDI Duo Card from Blackmagic and works fine in WO :-( with the same signal and without any ref. input, just the SDI cable in.

 

In the old WO player - Strange thing happened that I can't replicate in the new system is that in WO if we have 1 SDI input source in 1 output screen we can see the image error effect, but if we have 2 or more input sources the effect disappeared and the image it's presented without the error in WO. I can't replicate this in the others WO systems even downgrading to WO 6.1.2

 

I think there is an error on the processing table of the Datapath card related to the 1080i@25Hz or there is an error in WO related to this 1080i@25Hz using the API (the Vision Windows API it's the same that the WO uses), why the Datapath Vision Windows show the 8 images at the same time or 1 image at a time without errors and WO doesn't?

[Nigel]

Hi

 

We are experiencing very similar problem at 1080i 50Hz

 

Approx top 3rd of the xcreen has problems and is not in sync with the bottom two thirds.

 

Did you get any answer from Datapath?

[jfk]

... It looks like a sync problem. They asked if we can put a REF signal in, but we can’t do that in the VisionSC-SDI4 ...

 

You would input the REF signal to the WATCHOUT computer, not the input card.

  i.e. add an AMD S400 to provide genlock for the WATCHOUT computer.

Your setup will accommodate the S400.

(BTW The S400 does not consume any PCIe lanes,

 just consumes the physical space of a PCIe slot.

it is placed in a PCIe slot strictly as a mounting solution

 with convenient backplane connections.

The S400's only electrical connection is via a ribbon cable to your FirePro.)

 

All input signals should be synced at the source, to the same REF signal.

I would assume your inputs are coming from an SDI matrix switch,

and typically in a broadcast environment,

the matrix and everything on it is locked to house synch.

You want to lock the WATCHOUT computer to house synch as well.

[Nigel]

I understand the SYNC card will SYNC the outputs, does it have any impact on the Capture input?

 

I tried setting the SYNC on the S400 card from the output source and there is still a problem.

 

The problem with the Datapath capture card is happening on a single output.

 

Have Dataton been talking to Datapath regarding the issue and if so, what are the outcomes as I thought the Datapath cards were pre certified and tested?

[Nigel]

FYI,

 

Please see reply below from Datapath regarding temporary fix for issue.

 

Hello Nigel,
We have tested Watchout here capturing 1080i 50Hz(25Hz) in to a Vision SDI4 card and have reproduced the error.
We have a work around for you to apply that should give you a temporary fix for a bug where LiveStream is automatically turned on causing the error you are experiencing.
The attached dgc133.sys file should be uncompressed and saved in to C:\Windows\System32\drivers replacing the existing file.
Re start the computer and test the Watchout playback of the captured signals.
This is a temporary work around and will need to be applied for each Watchout Display PC with a Vision capture card installed.
We expect to release a new version of Vision in the near future with an updated VHDL that includes this fix.
I hope this helps and look forward to your feedback.
Ian.
Datapath Support.

 

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fm8h1jlfyeiobr9/AABjozO9O7BoiRuxpQkrQqWna?dl=0

[Jocelino]

Hi all,

 

Datapath reproduced the error and find out a bug that would be solved in the next release version of Vision with an updated VHDL that includes this fix.

 

In a meanwhile there is a file that they sent to me that is a temporary work around and solves the problem.

Should give you a temporary fix for a bug where LiveStream is automatically turned on causing the error you are experiencing. You will need to copy the file to all your display PCs at the folder C:\Windows\System32\Drivers and replace the one that is there.

 

 

use this link:

 

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/101240780/VisionSDI4%20-%20Watchout%20Fix.zip

 

Please check if the capture quality it's good at your side. (I think the quality it's lower than the usual Datapah catpure quality)

 

We've compared side by side the SDI Input signal and the captured signal with VisionSC-SDI and the quality it's lower than the usual Datapath capture quality (compressed quality) and I don't know if it's the card or the work around.

 

Thanks

 

Jocelino

[NNinja]

Since we are experiencing similiar issues on brand new display computers I've just checked for a new driver version before trying the fix - there is a new driver dated 23rd June.

Tomorrow we'll test and I'll post if problems are fixed

[NNinja]

I can confirm - using the driver version from June 23rd in user mode solves most of the problems